I keep hearing about this internet thing. Maybe some day I will try it.

More on that $500 / month

Main problem is that here, like in the US, these money don't buy a full time developer. Not even a lousy, do-exactly-how-told one.

Purchasing parity ratio helps a bit: it's like paying $1000 somewhere in the midwest.

One option would be to hire half time (4h a day). The other, to hire in India.
Permalink Io 
February 16th, 2017 10:59am
Maybe 4h / day in India? By purchasing parity, that would be $4000 in the midwest.
Permalink Io 
February 16th, 2017 11:01am
What you're talking about is less than Indian developers make in India.
Permalink Pegular Roaster 
February 16th, 2017 11:03am
Most recent salary survey of india shows a developer makes an average of 711,652 rupees annually. That's $10,621 USD.
Permalink Pegular Roaster 
February 16th, 2017 11:05am
Also, that is how much they are paid by their Indian employer. The rate you will pay that Indian employer will be significantly higher.
Permalink Pegular Roaster 
February 16th, 2017 11:06am
There would be a tremendous advantage to hire locally as I could reuse the guy for software contracts that I plan as a side thing to my side thing of hiring a guy. And develop a full software house, product-based. There's a lot of work from either EU or US but unless you show them something, you've got no chance.

Businesses only contract with businesses. I gotta exploit our competitive advantage while it lasts, although it's late stage. And that advantage is, cost. We're still relatively cheap but that's changing.
Permalink Io 
February 16th, 2017 11:09am
>> Stop blabbering here, you idiot and start coding.

Dr H, I've coded some 50k lines of code so far and reached a threshold where I need to hire to support this further. I'll still code but can't cover everything I have in mind in reasonable time with the amount of spare time I got.

It's hard but I think I'll better use that time by telling others what to do. And paying them.
Permalink Io 
February 16th, 2017 11:13am
Sure if I could hire a top developer locally for $500/mo I for sure would be farming him out locally and be a body shop.

Fantastic plan, assuming I can find such a person. Or 10. Or 100.

There's a severe IT talent shortage. Just not enough top notch people that will work 168 hours a month for $500 total including taxes and overhead.
Permalink Pegular Roaster 
February 16th, 2017 11:15am
I keep getting better and I found a niche but to do shit properly I'd need a year unstressed. Year that I don't have working two jobs but I can pay for.

As Warren Buffet put it, if you can't find a way to make your money work for you while you're sleeping, you're gonna die working.
Permalink Io 
February 16th, 2017 11:16am
Find someone else who needs a developer for around the same price and hire one together to share.
Permalink Kenny the Robot 
February 16th, 2017 11:22am
>> Just not enough top notch people that will work 168 hours a month for $500 total.

Amen to that :)

But talented people do exist. In far less quantities than spineless drones that would do the same should you pay them $400 in India or $4000 in the US.

Obviously this ain't easy but this doesn't mean it's not possible. I'm one of the people you could buy for $500 back in 2000. In fact noone offered "that much", my generous employer gave me $200.
Permalink Io 
February 16th, 2017 11:25am
Do you want real advice or are we just screwing around like usual here?

If you really want to run a body shop and make a lot of money, you can, but not the way you are talking.
Permalink Pegular Roaster 
February 16th, 2017 12:18pm
>> Do you want real advice or are we just screwing around like usual here?

Definitely not screwing around, I'm sick of that.

This time I'm up to making real money and I almost can feel the smell.

OK, what would be your strategy?
Permalink Io 
February 16th, 2017 2:01pm
You are in Romania.

You: speak english, understand american/english culture, are a competent developer able to accurately evaluate developer skills when hiring.

Current average developer salary in Romania is $25,033.

You can only hire an average developer for that rate.

So you offer $50,000 with full benefits. That's $25/hr cost for 200 hrs a year.

You bill at $80-$175/hr, depending on specific skills needed.

You become rich.
Permalink Pegular Roaster 
February 16th, 2017 2:09pm
Well, that's generally my plan too: charge more in order to be able to pay more in order to be able to deliver higher quality.

There's only one problem: maybe higher quality is not necessary.
Permalink Io 
February 16th, 2017 2:13pm
Fuck off, you are a retard and don't get it.

The key is not you charging more.

The key is you paying more.

You ready to pay $50,000 to your local Romanian guys?

If you aren't, you're a loser, and stop talking, you're wasting my time.
Permalink Pegular Roaster 
February 16th, 2017 2:32pm
A guy has some of the attributes needed to succeed. But not all of them. He's a loser. He'll always be a loser.
Permalink Pegular Roaster 
February 16th, 2017 2:33pm
No, I'm not ready. I'm as ready as you are in paying $250k to your superstars, genius.

If you were doing yourself a tenth of what you're trolling others, you wouln't be wasting your time with losers on some obscure board.
Permalink Io 
February 16th, 2017 2:43pm
Oh, OK.
Permalink Pegular Roaster 
February 16th, 2017 2:45pm
It somehow escaped me that if I had $50k to pay 5 developers for 5 years, I would get rich. Maybe because if I had that resources I'd already be rich?
Permalink Io 
February 16th, 2017 2:55pm
God bless the child, that's got its own, that's got its own.
Permalink SaveTheHubble 
February 16th, 2017 2:59pm
>>Current average developer salary in Romania is $25,033.

>>You can only hire an average developer for that rate.

So find a fresh grad that's brilliant and has a good work ethic but maybe has a quality that makes him a difficult hire because of prejudice.
Permalink Kenny the Robot 
February 16th, 2017 5:05pm
OP - If your business is only viable if you can hire a competent programmer for $500/month, then you don't have a viable business.

If you try to hire someone for $500/month, you will need to spend so much time checking their work that it won't be worth your time.  And if you do spend time training them to be a competent programmer, they'll switch jobs as soon as possible.

Your options are:

1. Do the work yourself.

2. Find a different idea where you can afford to pay market rates.

For example, for my game development ideas, I'm *NOT* spending money on other people until I get revenue to justify it.
Permalink FSK 
February 16th, 2017 6:59pm
Sure, I could pay a top developer $50,000 a year and bill them at $175/hr.

But I have a better plan. I will hire an acceptably good developer for $500/month and bill them at $175/hr.

That is more profit for me, and a better business model.

I'm surprised people here can't do the math on this.
Permalink Yo 
February 16th, 2017 7:36pm
If it was that easy to hire someone for $500/month and rebill them for $175/hr, then every outsourcing project ever would be a smashing success.
Permalink FSK 
February 16th, 2017 10:02pm
They ARE smashing successes, up until the time something delivered has to WORK, and then they're just a smash.
Permalink SaveTheHubble 
February 17th, 2017 11:36am

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